Tuesday, November 20, 2007

Another lie from Steve-in-NC

This was brought to my attention just recently. It's on the Network 54 Yellow Pages Forum.

Steve in NC July 11 2006, 9:17 AM (Login pneuguy)

The ONLY aftermarket hammer debounce device that WORKS is my design. And it was stolen...

...a couple of weeks after its introduction by my so-called "partner," Bob Werner. Thanks to Bob's greed, it's now off the market. So now there's none.Which is a pity. Because there was quite a lot of work wrapped up in its development and, as Larry's effort here proves, making a debouncer that actually works, ain't so easy.


What a liar and hypocrite Steve is.

I never stole anything from him let alone the HDD's. I split the remaining HDD inventory with Steve when we parted company and wholesaled mine out immediately. The Right handed ones sold out in two weeks and I still have a couple of the old left handed ones left that never did sell. Yes, it's off the market now as far as I'm concerned because I don't make them anymore. I have never made a single HDD, not one, since we parted company and never will.

Also, if you look back, he and Skyler have been selling these all along so it seems or at least they are on Skylers website. Steve is so full of bull, lies and deception.

Wednesday, November 14, 2007

Regarding Tim's (the manufacturer) effort to correct Steve-in NC's fabrications and falsehoods

on the YP's in regards to the below article and how it was immediatly deleted in an attempt preventing anybody from reading it.

Here a copy of the e-mail that I sent to Walter G that I received from Tim (my manufacturer) after his efforts to inform those on the YP's of the incorrectness of Steve-in-NC statements and claims.


I just got a call from Tim.

Tim did respond to the thread that I was referring to in my e-mail. At first Tim said he had difficulty posting it but was finally able to get it up a little after midnight. I guess he had to go through some process. However, once it was posted, it was deleted within a matter of a couple of hours and when he tried to repost it, it seems that he no longer could post. Anyhow, below is a copy of the e-mail that he sent me along with a copy of the post that was deleted.

Steve had to get rid of the post fast and at that time of night I doubt many would have had the opportunity to read it in the short time that it was up.

I tried to put the below post on the YP Gamo forum last night but was unable to post it at first. I was finally able to get it posted a little after midnight. I was finally able to post but it was deleted a short time later. I made a copy of the post at first because I had trouble posting and saved it just in case.

Post Preview
Regarding the GTX triggers
November 13 2007 at 10:54 PM

First I would like to let everyone know that I am the person that manufactured the triggers for Charlie and Steve when they were partners. Charlie approached me to make the triggers because he was having a lot of problems with both the p00r design issues, safety, and they were being poorly manufactured overseas.

I was not provided with any detailed dimentional drawing and had nothing but a basic picture, the original version trigger to start with. We, Charlie and I, did everything starting from scratch. Charlie spent many nights and much testing while redesigning the trigger in order for it to work with efficiency as well as a functioning safety. It was shortly after Charlie perfected it when their partnership broke up. It was then that I was approached by Steve and he wanted to have one design and wanted Charlie to have another another design. That's when I decided to not make any triggers or other parts for them at all. My intent was to stay impartial and neutral.

Steve, your misrepresenting the facts and is not true. And I am not manufacturing the GRT-III trigger as claimed in this or any other post for Steve or Skyler either one and do not intend to. Leave me out of this mess.
I expect that this post will be deleted almost immediatly but we will see.


Deception about Steve's-Skylers triggers and more

This is in regards to one of the latest tactics of Steve-in-NC. I sent an e-mail to Walter G in response to a post.

Hi Walter:

I very seldom e-mail people regarding posts made on the YP’s but when I do, it’s only that I cannot respond to their post (including yours) in any other way.

Perhaps you don’t want to hear what I have to say or even have no interest in my side of the controversy and I am certainly not asking you to take sides. Hopefully you will give me the courtesy of reading this but if not, I understand with no ill feelings on my part.

Regarding your post on the YP-Gamo and the responses


There is no truth in what Steve has said in his posts and makes those statements only to discredit me and further his own agenda. I can only put up posts on my forum, the GTA, regarding issues because it’s the only way I can put up any defense at all and others from the YP’s are either members here also under different names or at least come to the GTA and read the posts. He knows as do you and many others, that I have absolutely no way of defending myself on the YP’s or can anybody else post a defense on my behalf because he will immediately (or have CT Steve) delete them and usually ban the person that makes the post. As you well know, they always “disappear” within a very short time keeping as few as possible from viewing them.

I just wanted to make some points about that post.

Steve’s statement about: In fact every single... GTX blade that was ever made, worked. There were no "failures”.

They were all failures, all of them but the reason that they worked and there were in his words, “no failures” is because I had to remake them, every single one. And then there was still the problem that the safeties did not work even when they were reworked. It could not be made to work without failing because of the design. I had to make a lot of refunds because the customers were so dissatisfied and I made those refunds with no questions asked.

Below is the first MK-1-GTX that Steve designed (he never shows this), had made and sent to me that I had to grind out the nose to make work as well as modify the pivot holes to even get the pins in. No safety and not first stage adjustable.

(sorry but I could not post the picture here)

In his post, the upper left picture (in the group of three) is the second version of Steve’s trigger, MK-I GTX ver.2 that he had made and shipped to me. I had to do a lot of work on every one of them to make them work and able to sell. It too wasn’t first stage adjustable and still had the safety issue.

The bottom trigger in the group was his third (and final) version he had made that had an adjustment screw but was incorrectly placed and incorrect angle. The pivot pin holes were still incorrect and every one had to be drilled oversize and hand fitted to be able to fit into the trigger. And the safety was not right. This was the GTX-I. He just never got it right….ever….and I was sick of it.

Every trigger Steve ever had made and sent to me were sub-manufactured by E-Machine and made off shore. It was cheap, a little over $4.00 each as I recall, and the end results very bad due both in part to faulty design as well as poor workmanship. Not a single one of them would have ever been sold had I not reworked them. He knows it and I know it.

It was at this point that I informed Steve that I was tired of having to redo every trigger to make them work and done peddling his trigger and dealing with customers. I refused to take any more triggers that he made and was going to try to find someone locally to hopefully design manufacture and a trigger that would not only function properly but not need to be modified or repaired.

And that’s what I did. I finally found Tim that was not only a machinist but also happened to be somewhat of an AG enthusiast. After a couple of months and much trial and error and testing, we got it right. The new trigger became the GTX-II. That is the trigger on the upper right in Steve’s group of three. He had absolutely no input to the redesign of that trigger. It was a new approach to the concept and to the trigger and its problems.

My cost to manufacture the new GTX-II triggers doubled not including the setup and CNC programming. We ate those ourselves. Steve never shared in those costs but even then, I continued to pay him ½ of the net profit until the day that we “dissolved” our partnership on 6/30/06. (It might be noted that I paid him 50% of the net profits all along and he did absolutely nothing in the past except send me inferior product during our entire “partnership”). On that final day I issued him a final check of $2036.87. In addition to the check, I sent him ½ of the entire final parts inventory of all the products of which there were 28 GTX-III and sent him 14. I never cheated him out of a single dime.

The first of the GTX-II’s (the new series of triggers that Tim and I designed and manufactured) came off the line on 12/09/05.

Tim and I improved it further and the next trigger revision, the GTX-III, came off the line on 7/7/06. (The pictures shown of the GRT-III on the lower part of that post and were the ones that the manufacturer and I made and not Steve’s as he would like to make you and everybody else believe).

Then later, after the split with Steve on 6/30/06, we improved it even further and renamed it the GRT-III trigger. It came off the line about 8/15/06.

I have always given Steve the credit for the original concept and design but standing on its own, it never would have worked as designed regardless of what he would like others to believe. However, the GTX-II trigger forward to the GRT-III trigger of today is not his trigger design but was the time and hard work put into it by Tim and me.

Steve’s and a couple of others statements about me being a liar, crook, and thief among other things is ridiculous. I doubt that you can find a single person anywhere that can honestly say that I have cheated them or stole from them or lied to them or bilked them out of anything at any time. That’s not to say that Steve wouldn’t get someone to make that kind of a statement which he certainly is capable of doing.

And one last point… I contacted Tim after the post was brought to my attention and he told me that the post by Steve were lies and were not true at all. The triggers that Skyler is now marketing were not made by Tim, the person that made my triggers in the past. In fact, he will have absolutely nothing to do with Steve and has no respect for him. I am good friends with Tim and see him almost weekly and for Steve to make the statement:

“I think there were a few years there (like 1861 to 1865) when it wasn't. And actually, Walter, just to improve the story, the GTX blades being sold by Skyler were made by the same SC machinest who refused to continue to make them for that scaley fellow, when the fishie guy "retired."It seems the machinest couldn't be talked into forgetting whose name was on the original dimensioned drawings he was given to do the CNC programming from.Short version: there really are honest men out there.Steve”

This is Steve, again “And actually, Walter, just to improve the story”, just improving his story….. And again, this is far from the truth and Tim has never made any triggers or any other parts for Steve or Skyler ever. Any parts that were by Tim were either though me or for me.

Tim told me that he is going to put up a response up to the post stating that Steve’s claims are untrue and that they are not his triggers. I expect that it won’t last long though.

Walter…I have no reason to lie and Steve has every reason in his mind for lying and his bitterness. He will do everything in his power to discredit and to destroy me because he no longer has a ninny and cash cow that he had taken advantage of for so long. He received a great deal of money for nothing for a long time and at my expense and when I finally had enough and ended it, he couldn’t handle it and has been relentless in his retribution ever since.

Steve is an admitted atheist, and in my opinion, an unscrupulous person without conscience and he has no qualms about straying from the truth, creating deception and being less than honest or doing whatever it takes to destroy someone or their character for whatever his reason or at his whim. Having been in partnership and working with him on a personal level, I am fully aware of how he thinks, what he is capable of doing and how he does it, especially when it comes to his own benefit and ego or what ever fits his agenda. I feel sorry for Steve and perhaps one day the Lord will come into his heart. Perhaps you have no religious belief and that is fine but I myself just happen to be a Christian and I know He leads me in the right directions and I’ve always tried to do what’s right and that’s all that really matters to me.

Thank you for your time and indulgence Walter and sorry for the rambling.

Bob Werner aka: Charlie